While I’m not a fan of Big tech, but this surely is nonsense. Are they saying there are more vibrations than, say, living in New York? Near those train lines and billions of cars (and there are probably data centers there too).
You better watch this video by Benn Jordan about exactly this issue: https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo
He measured the reported issue.
Here is a timestamp witg the datacenrer noise isolated: https://youtu.be/_bP80DEAbuo?t=540
Yeah, but do you know what’s super useful? Molotov cocktails.
drones/balloons with long metal wire dangling down.
Not sure how effective that would be unless you were able to get inside the building and could strategically deliver them.
What you really need is a drone that can drop thermite, then lower a small EMP device into the hole.
I was thinking 308 punches holes in sides of.computers
Just tax the fucking things already. Fuck tax breaks and kick out any administrators who take the bribes and go against the wishes of their constituents.
Woah woah woah, let’s not get hasty. I say we dismember the administrators for taking bribes. Why just kick them out?
Why wouldn’t you do that to the board of directors of the companies bribing the officials? When removing weeds you need to pull out the roots.
When did they say not to?
Ah, the chimpanzee method.
It really weirds me out that gratuitous violence as a response to societal injustice is so common on Lemmy, if not across Humanity as a whole. Like let’s say this back-to-basics style of justice comes about in modern society and all the relevant assholes are subjected to it. What then? At least, what would the violence even be in the name of? Retribution? How is that productive in any way?
I realize this is a pretty disproportionate response to a relatively banal comment, but I see sentiments such as this one (either intended as sarcasm or not) so often here that I’m essentially using this as a catch-all spot for my thoughts on it.
I’ll just end this tangent with a quote about this sort of thing from a guy way smarter than me (and I promise I’m not just trying to be pretentious it actually applies.)
Absolute freedom mocks at justice. Absolute justice denies freedom. To be fruitful, the two ideas must find their limits in each other. - My buddy Albert Camus
I think you are just seeing the pot boil over more and more.
It wasn’t like this 2 years ago.
Yeah, the violence would be in the name of justice and retribution!
The chimpanzee method, as you call it, is the best form of justice for those sub-human billionaire and multi-millionaire urchins who kill, rape, and eat children.
Unless, of course, you’re okay with that form of violence? Are you okay with the violence inherent in the capitalist system?
Like where do you draw the line for violence and retribution?
Don’t put words in my mouth, they taste too salty.
To an extent violence is an effective tool: that I can definitely agree with. There’s never been any social progress without blood being shed on some level.
It’s when it turns into a gratuitous means of communal catharsis that it becomes inherently counterintuitive by serving no other practical outcome than creating murderers and dehumanizers out of progressives. And these sub-humans and urchins you speak of are, whether you like it or not, extremely human, and even further than that are direct products of the societies that we’ve been complacent in for our entire lives and, likewise, we are also products of.
So to answer your question clearly, I draw the line at violence when it’s in the name of the abstract: not only because I oppose things like the death penalty as a matter of principle, but because violence for an ideal or ideals is valuable to no one and nothing. No one gains anything material by destroying for the sake of it. It’s just that: destructive. Something I wish we humans learned a long time ago, but I digress.
This would be hell for me.
The same argument is used by opponents of wind energy - Infrasound is having bad effects on their health. People do say that while living next to roads that are producing infrasound multiple times louder than wind turbines ever could.
It’s a nice argument if you need it.
There’s documented proof of this being measured by multiple people.
A windmill is literally only a visual blight.
Have a number of big fans run at almost the same frequency, and you get an onslaught of waves at the differences of those frequencies.
As they are all nearly the same speed/frequency, the differences will be infrasound, which causes a lot of odd effects on people, like anxiety.
So basically the data centers could alleviate their sound problems by having all their fans run at opposite frequencies to cancel our the sound through deconstructive interference
The problem is that you cannot get them synced sufficiently. You basically have to route the complete air flow through a padded chamber to dampen their own and the derived sounds.
And do something that’s good for people at virtually no expense? Haha, no.
Or better, shutting down entirely.
Or soundproof the building.
Isn’t it really difficult to soundproof against the low frequency noises?
Just use corrugated cardboard and with longer sine waves, duh!
I am not an audio engineer but you might have a point in that the longer low sound waves would be harder to block.
Where my audiophiles at? We need a sound check on low frequency blocking.
Edit:
Found an article on a crypto mining facility mitigating noise issues.https://noisemonitoringservices.com/data-center-noise-control/
https://www.soundtrace.com/blog/data-center-noise-levels-hearing-conservation-osha-compliance
Also found an article stating that underwater data centers would be the best way to reduce noise. Ignoring that sound travels better underwater and combined with heating the water around them, it would massively disrupt untold amounts of marine life, sure!
Benn Jordan leveraged his expertise in audio engineering to investigate this phenomenon. Do watch.
does he have the video’s research published?
Benn Jordan is like an anarchist Mr. Rogers.
We need an anarchist Mr. Rogers. Just someone pure of heart to talk to kids about taking care of their neighbors no matter what the government says. Little everyday lessons in consensus and how to deal with the conflicts that arise when different people have different big feelings. How everyone is special just for being themselves and we should encourage our neighbors to be their unique selves.
I don’t disagree, but I feel like the actual Mr. Rogers probably created a lot of Anarchists on his own! I think everything he teaches is not just cohesive with, but runs parallel to, Anarchist teachings. Taking care of yourself and your community is the foundation of Anarchism. I don’t know if being explicit would necessarily help, and it could push some people away from hearing the message.
He was too friendly with cops though.
Totally agree.
so, a huge improvement. :)
Benn Jordan is a gem, do yourself a favor and just go watch all his stuff.
His latest on robot dogs is amazingly well-executed and researched with terrifying conclusions.
Listen to his music, too! It’s amazing! I’ve seen him a few times and one time the equipment at the festival didn’t work so he just improvised his whole set. He was insanely good at it. So much vocoder, it was delightful!
this is a great video
This is so stupid I cant believe people fall for it
What makes you assume this is bogus, when it’s been shown repeatedly that it can negatively affect people. Just because you’re not sensitive to it, doesn’t mean no one else is.
Lol. Just linked the same video! :D
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/comment/26736540Yeah none of that expertise is relevant here. I like Ben but this video has no substance.
Lol what. Besides the actual scientific tests and result analysis? No substance?
The US has a serious problem with who is able to sue for what damages when it comes to pollution. Depending on if it’s noise, water, or air, the legal codes are not effective at protecting property or people.
As SCOTUS keeps ruling (most recently, yesterday) corporations are people (id est, have rights) but human beings do not.
Publicize the costs, privatize the profits!
Depending on if it’s noise, water, or air, the legal codes are not effective at protecting property or people.
Boy, it’s almost like those are meant to protect something and someone else… Hm… 🤔
we’ve had data centres for 40 years how did this only recently come up in America?
Ngl didn’t read the article
Ooh a question I can answer. I will make the answer as neutral as I can just explaining the differences of old Data Centers and new ones.
I worked in several data centers (DC). But all were air cooled. These AI DCs are also called Hyper scales. They need liquid due to the density of heat production. In addition some literally use jet engines to power them instead of grid power. Some new DCs use loopholes like adding wheels to their power production so that way they can skirt around laws saying it’s only temporary power production.
In the past a rack (42u standard) would hold things like hard drives, tape libraries, network stuff, and servers. Now they cram in GPUs by the dozens, run them at max via liquid cooling. Traditional DC cooling used air cooled hot and cold isles, raised floors with air conditioning pump and large scale chiller units.
Hyper scales are whole different animals. They are ment for processing. Depending on their loop system they need water connected right to GPU/CPUs, heat distribution, fresh water. All relatively new due to water’s thermal mass.
Traditional DCs were air cooled. For perspective a fortune 500’s DC may have been 3k sq ft. A Colo (multiple companies sharing one building for infrastructure) may be 15000-50000sq ft. These new data centers are now campuses. Like they are 8 data center buildings on one site because it’s more practical to drive at some point.
TL;DR a Data Center =/= hyperscale data center.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2026/jan/15/elon-musk-xai-datacenter-memphis
So they build them cheaply and doing everything in their power to avoid regulations. We really need the government to come in and shut these down given all the harm they cause to their local environment.
We really need the government to come in and shut these down given all the harm they cause to their local environment
But the government is helping pave the way for it.
It was a theoretical thing. Government is supposed to work for the people, not just corporations. Obviously the government in the US is not doing a good job at that.
You’re right. They are not. At. All.
A government worried about the environment… That usually only happens in times of mass outrage, chances of which might decrease over time by modern
propagandacommunication strategies.Yeah. People don’t understand why I’m not anti-datacenter (let me finish before you dog-pile me). Datacenters are very efficient ways to house lots of compute. Power, HVAC, and staffing all benefit from economies of scale. Most of our modern life is highly depent on datacenters, including application specific AI tools (not LLMs, but like medical imaging analysis tools) that will have positive effects on humanity. I do have problems with datacenters that are going up quickly and cheaply, with lax standards for air, water, sound and light pollution, and power subsidized by the surrounding homes, in order to ride the front of this very unstable AI bubble.
Before you ask, I did sign the petition to limit datacenters in my state. I’d sign one to limit new datacenter construction nation-wide. Datacenters are essential to modern life, which is exactly why we should have a higher standard for how they are constructed. I’m not anti-data center, but I am anti-whatever-the-fuck-this-is.
so same thing as for wind turbines then
Edit: as in, they should not be built where people live because you can feel the vibrations and it has a measurable effect on your vascular health. i linked a paper.
For those speaking german, I’m linking to a podcast episode of the Quarks Science Cops (Public Broadcast) about this topic. Link to Youtube
Spoiler: We already have way louder infrasound producers near us. Wind turbines are already build in quite a distance to be safe from flying debris in case of a catastrophic mechanical breakdown of the spinning blades.
Wind turbines don’t make infrasound like datacenters. While they do make some infrasound, it’s less loud than datacenters, and most impostantly, doesn’t get transmitted really far (air is pretty inefficient at transmitting infrasound).
However, datacenters are louder, and have better mechanical connection with the ground. The ground is very good at transmitting infrasound, and it can even vibrate an entire building if the structure resonates. This effect is not new, and we’ve also seen it with other industrial buildings with heavy machinery. Furthermore, due to regulations, you can’t build as close to a wind farm as you can to a datacenter.
I noticed this effect when city buses were idling about a block away from my old house. It would hit just right (just wrong?) on a really noticable resonance frequency for that place. It used to make it hard to fall asleep if I went to bed after midnight.
I don’t notice weird vibrations like that much at my current address, fortunately.
that’s why i mean it’s the same thing. don’t build them near people. we know ground-transferred infrasound is bad for your health.
as for louder, idk. i worked next to a facebook dc for years, it was eerily quiet.
I’d say the traditional long-term type of DCs arent as badly built as those built atm that looks like they can be deconstructed in a single week.
Old data centers and these new things are about as similar as a single family home and a cruise ship.
See SUMO’s comment above.
interestingly the one i was next to was one of the first to use the evaporative cooling tech most of them use now. it was developed partly at my university.
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There’s tons of evidence for data centers, but I’ve never heard the same for wind turbines. Do you have a source?
Can confirm I have seen tons of articles over the years of residents complaining about low frequency hum from wind turbines. Just Google it. In comments sections, it generally gets written off as bullshit or the residents just hating clean energy. Now the same scenario comes up for data centers and people want to accept it as a legitimate problem.
I dunno, but maybe being exposed to a constant non-stop noise that never turns off might not be good for humans, no matter what the source is.
i’ve heard it a lot but never put much stock in it until there was actual research: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-97107-8
I would love to see your explanation for why wind turbines have as much a negative impact on people’s health as hyperscale data centers.
apparently low-frequency noise causes heart rate variations. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-97107-8
the conclusion is the same for both things too: don’t build them where people live.
From the first scimming, I would not give much credit to that study. Only 29 participants. But most importantly it was not double blind. The participants where instructed on what exactly the study wanted to find out and could easily see, how far they where from the wind turbine at the testing sides. Thats a programmed placebo effect.
Also: They only measured at 2 sites. The outdoor site was only 20m from the wind turbine. That is a distance not even relevant to placement of wind turbines. The safety distance to the spinning blades will already be significantly higher, at least 100m. So the measurement at that side might be interesting, but irrelevant.
yeah it’s not very good. but it’s one study of many and it was more to show that people are actually having issues with them.
We really need to focus on more offshore wind for this reason.
Of course, its so simple!
Thank you
