• Shatur@discuss.tchncs.de
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    3 days ago

    Okay, maybe I rushed with “any source”. 15850 are UN numbers, but 5600 comes from TASS. If look at UN numbers it’s 3404. In the graph you can also see that most casualties happened in first 2 years, after that it was a cold conflict.

    And only 2 deaths?

    Okay, what about the Hroza strike, which killed 52 people? Or the recent attack on Kyiv after the Ukrainian college strike, when a house was struck by a drone twice - doesn’t that sound like an air defense system malfunctioned?

    That hospital could be gone if they wanted it, and the rest of Kiev with it.

    So do Ukraine could kill civilians more actively. Surely not on the same scale as Russia, but still. This doesn’t happen because it isn’t practical, both in terms of media and money.

    It is nothing like the almost daily attacks on markets in Donetsk with countless more civilians killed.

    So do Ukrainian-controlled towns have also been hit by Russian attacks, including markets and shops.

    Like the ridiculous story where they blamed Russians for targeting the nuclear plant in Zaporizia.

    And I agree with you here. I don’t think it was Russia. But it’s not like only Ukraine tells ridiculous stories. For example, the Kakhovka Dam was blown up by an internal explosion while it was under Russian control, which is suspicious, to say the least.

    • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
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      3 days ago

      It’s hard to get any news here that’s not from western biased sources since everything gets censored and blocked to ‘keep us safe from Russian propaganda’.
      So it’s difficult to look into all these specific events.
      But a quick look shows it was a funeral for Andriy Kozyr, a nazi POS.
      Obviously there would be plenty other nazis. Not just some normal funeral.
      While it’s unfortunate there are civilian casualties (for which we only have accounts from one side) it can not be sold as purely hitting civilians.

      And the Kakhovka Dam was indeed held by Russia.
      And you believe it’s not a ridiculous story that they would blow it up knowing the north (UA) ground is higher and the lower south side where the Russian troop are would flood?
      It also cut off water supply for Crimea and endangered the cooling of the Zaporizia nuclear power plant.
      So logic would suggest this is as much a BS as them targeting that same plant under their control.

      • Shatur@discuss.tchncs.de
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        2 days ago

        Russia claimed that he was a neo-Nazi, but I don’t see any evidence for that. It’s not like Russian media aren’t biased. That’s how it always works: both sides try to deflect casualties they caused and present casualties caused by the other side as war crimes.

        Armies sometimes take actions that damage their own side if the broader military benefit is worth it. In this case dam’s destruction disrupted Ukrainian plans for a Dnipro crossing operation. It was at the time of Ukranian counter-offense. Since it was an inner explosion, I have a hard time believing that Ukrainian saboteurs came to the dam unnoticed and detonated. This was not like planting a small bomb near a road. Destroying a huge hydroelectric dam is not easy. And Russia didn’t catch anyone or present any evidence of that afterwards.

        • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
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          2 days ago

          Russia claimed that he was a neo-Nazi, but I don’t see any evidence for that

          No, just a guy who is into Norse mythology again, the valknut tattoo is harmless as the wolfangel, black suns,etc… that show up like clockwork up in photo’s from these guys.
          I forgot the ‘no nazis in ukraine’ mantra.

          damage their own side if the broader military benefit is worth it

          That’s some serious mental gymnastics.
          Did you miss my comments about the awful consequences?
          There were zero advantages to Russia.
          That great announced summer offensive had no chance to begin with.
          The Russians had retreated strategically in Kherson (like in the east) and made defensive preparations.
          It was the time wen they changed to attrition war.
          Anything ukraine sent over the Dnipro got blown up, at best some poor suckers made it long enough to make a propaganda video and plant a flag. After which they got killed anyway.
          The Russians couldn’t be happier having a turkey shoot from a safe distance anytime they sent another human wave in that meatgrinder. And it didn’t have to be saboteurs, a Stormshadow missile or whatever the UK/US gave to their proxy army would do the trick.

          • Shatur@discuss.tchncs.de
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            2 days ago

            I mean do you have a proof for that specific guy?

            The mentioned consequences for Russia weren’t significant. No power plant exploded and Crimea had already lived with the canal mostly blocked from 2014 to 2022. There was no rocket, it’s confirmed. No one else could blow it up, that’s the problem.

            • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
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              2 days ago

              I mean do you have a proof for that specific guy?

              A guy with a nazi tattoo is a nazi.
              Not that it mattered to this matter of the strike, the point is that he was military and plenty of military there.
              The inhabitants said they were far enough from the front and never even heard sounds of bombs.
              Russia never targeted that unimportant tiny place.
              Only when they had high ranking military in one place.
              They aren’t going to waste a 4$ million Iskander on a few peasants.

              The mentioned consequences for Russia weren’t significant. No power plant exploded and Crimea had already lived with the canal mostly blocked from 2014 to 2022.

              Just because there wasn’t a nuclear disaster doesn’t mean it wasn’t immensely dangerous and criminal.
              Even the biased IAEA said so.

              it’s confirmed. No one else could blow it up

              Yup, no country besides Russia can blow stuff up from a distance.
              Especially since the entire NATO and other vassals are giving them everything they can.
              Russia probably blew up their Crimean bridge too.
              I’m sure the ukrainians can confirm that, and who wouldn’t believe them?

              • Shatur@discuss.tchncs.de
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                2 days ago

                A guy with a nazi tattoo is a nazi.

                Sure. But do you have any photo such tattoo on him? Also UN reports that the strike killed 59 civilians and no legitimate military target around.

                They aren’t going to waste a 4$ million Iskander on a few peasants.

                So why would Ukraine waste money on their rockets to kill civilians?..

                Yup, no country besides Russia can blow stuff up from a distance.

                I mean, yeah, you cannot explode things from a distance without something like a rocket or a drone.

                • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
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                  2 days ago

                  do you have any photo such tattoo on him?

                  Since you brought up his funeral I figured you might have one or take the effort to look for one if since you don’t believe it.
                  Well here he is:

                  Most of those Banderites don’t hide them since they are proud of being nazis.
                  Unless it may be too obvious and they’re on a propaganda or begging mission like this POS, honored in the US fascist regime Warrior games.
                  I’ll include the picture since you won’t take my word for it.


                  Of course the rest of his team wasn’t much better.

                  Here’s another ‘hero defender of Azovstal’ Dmytro Kozatsky, who did many interviews on US/EU TV and even found it a good idea to let him promoting his book and spread his ideology to US schoolchildren.

                  Rewarded with many prizes of course for his photo’s in the west.
                  Unfortunately these ones from his social media didn’t make it in the book.


                  But the media does their best in hiding all those things in their propaganda.
                  Plenty examples like this:
                  https://x.com/Gompers_Stomper/status/1976419781680206209

                  Such an unfortunate coincidence that in nearly every photo or video you see from ukrainian military there is one of their only 5 nazis in it.

                  So why would Ukraine waste money on their rockets to kill civilians?..

                  First of all they are wasting OUR EU money.
                  MY pension, my social welfare and everything they cut here to send money into the bottomless pit of corruption that is ukraine.
                  Gifts and loans that they can never pay back, they are already more than bankrupt.

                  Secondly, they don’t use expensive rockets for that.
                  They use cheap artillery or their favorite one, petal mines.
                  Which have been sown daily all over Donetsk (and other places) like on playgrounds killing and mutilating children who pick them up.
                  Of course ‘alledgedly’ according to the biased US news.
                  https://www.npr.org/2023/01/31/1152743054/human-rights-watch-ukraine-landmines

                  But that same press didn’t care to report on that inconvenient fact for 8 years.
                  They were too busy hiding inconvenient nazi emblems or flags.

                  • Shatur@discuss.tchncs.de
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                    2 days ago

                    Well here he is:

                    Which of his tattoo are Nazi ones?

                    Such an unfortunate coincidence that in nearly every photo or video you see from ukrainian military

                    You’ve said many times that your opinion is factual and objective, yet you constantly exaggerate things. Does Ukraine have a Nazi problem? Sure. There are neo-Nazi battalions, and the government plays along with it by proclaiming the UPA as heroes, etc. But most of the soldiers are not Nazis - they’re regular people. Especially now, when they’re being kidnapped from the streets to recruit into army. But if it’s like this in nearly every photo you use, then the media you consume is simply biased. Because for Russia, it’s convenient to portray every Ukrainian as a Nazi - it makes people less upset about the war.

                    Russia has Nazi and alt-right people in their army, BTW. Just not on the same scale.

                    First of all they are wasting OUR EU money.

                    Yeah, I didn’t say Ukrainian money 😅 But it’s not like Russia doesn’t have cheap rockets, right? Now drones are quite popular, too.

                    About mines - yes, I remember, it was awful, I agree.